| South Bend Light 10 gear cover
(Feb 25, 2001) |
9 " gear cover mounting pin
(Oct 5, 2003) |
| Gear cover question (9"
or 10") |
9" gear cover hinge pin
(Oct 10, 2003) |
| Of handles and covers
(Feb 25, 2002) |
10k motor belt guard (May
19, 2004) |
| SB 9" Gear Door Fit (Feb
8, 2003) |
End Gear Cover (Jan 25,
2005) |
| Back gear cover for a 10
(Aug 25, 2003) |
|
| |
| South Bend Light 10 gear cover
|
| I recently
purchased a South Bend Light 10. The lathe is great, however, The
gear cover on the left side is made of formed plastic and is held on
with two screws. On previous occasions, I had 9 inch lathes and they
had a heavy metal cast cover on a hinge type swivel. Is anyone
familiar with this plastic type cover? Is it normal on 10 inch
lathes? or is it something that Osha dreamed up to prevent easy
access to the gears and possible injury? The cover appears to be
factory made, however, the name South Bend does not appear on it.
Frank. (260) |
| Put up a picture as I have
never seen anything but a cast iron cover over the gear area and
those are swing out. All the ones I have seen up till the late 70s
on new machines were like the one on my machine in the picture. JWE
(261) |
| JWE, two photo's should appear showing
the formed plastic gear cover. As can be seen, it appears to be a
factory produced product. It is held on to the lathe with two
knurled screws one located just to the left of the spindle, and the
other in the lower right. If the original heavy metal door was
replaced, they also removed all the remnant hinge (swivel) hardware.
This lathe was manufactured in 1979. Everything else on the lathe
appears to be normal. I feel that this may be the work of OSHA, they
are notorious for demanding safety modifications on machinery. You
would think that if a person does not have enough sense to keep his
fingers out of the gears, then he shouldn't be running a lathe to
begin with. Frank. (264) |
| I see what you mean Frank. What I
would do is either shop Ebay or other sources for the CI cover and
hinge or make a hinge setup for the cover you have as that is worse
to work with than the ones on the 9x series of machines. JWE (265) |
| Actually, because I
have a quick change gear box, I do not need access to the gears
often enough to be concerned. My inquiry was to determine if anyone
had a similar set-up, or could explain the reason for the
modification. Frank (270) |
| Frank, Here is a SB 10K that sold
on eBay that also has the fiberglass side cover. (dead link) This SB 10K is the under motor drive and uses the
fiberglass cover. I have a SB 10K lathe with the UMD. My lathe is
from 1970. It has the cast iron gear cover, but it also has an
interlock set up that prevents you from opening the cover when the
lathe is running. It also prevents you from opening the belt access
cover when the lathe is running.
Bob (271) |
| Bob, I
appreciate the follow up. I guess the fiberglass cover may be an
original South Bend item after all. Frank
(274) |
| Frank, I have a
South Bend Lathe 10K that was made in 1979 and was one of their more
modern looking lathes. These were made "Off Shore" and the headstock
was a universal type that was used on both bench and cabinet style
lathes. I have included a page from the parts manual that will look
familiar. I also had a 10K lathe that was made in Dec. 1975 that had
a different style fiberglass gear cover. It was closer in shape to
the older swinging style cover but it was held on by a knurled
headed screw and a winged-nut. I think I have a 1944 vintage cover
off a model "A" bench lathe (cast iron) if you think you might want
it. Let me know. Webb (277) |
| Frank, I have a
South Bend Lathe 10K that was made in 1979 and was one of their more
modern looking lathes. These were made "Off Shore" and the headstock
was a universal type that was used on both bench and cabinet style
lathes. I have included a page from the parts manual that will look
familiar. I also had a 10K lathe that was made in Dec. 1975 that had
a different style fiberglass gear cover. It was closer in shape to
the older swinging style cover but it was held on by a knurled
headed screw and a winged-nut. I think I have a 1944 vintage cover
off a model "A" bench lathe (cast iron) if you think you might want
it. Let me know. Webb (278) |
| Webb, you
may be having a problem attaching a photo because it is too large, I
have been sizing mine to 7 inches and less than 100k, it seems to
work okay. I already have the parts list for the lathe which
includes the details covering the gear door. As to my 10K Lathe, I
may have the universal model that you described, it was manufactured
in 1979 and when I look through the headstock, I can see through to
the workbench. I attached two side by side photo's, the first photo
showing the see through section and the second photo showing a port
in the back of the base which also goes through to the bench. It
appears that the openings provide for belt passage. Because I do not
have another lathe to compare, I am not able to definitely determine
if I am on the right track. However, I get the impression that the
openings only appear in the universal type that you described. I
wonder if the fiberglass door is a definite indicator of the
universal model. You indicated that some models were made offshore,
do you know from where? I would appreciate your thoughts on the
photos and if you think that My model is of the universal type.
Frank. (281) |
| Gear cover
question (9" or 10") |
| Putting the pieces
back together, the end gear guard doesn't seem to fit this machine.
With the end gear guard inserted into the bracket, the spindle rubs
against the side of the cover. See attached photo "CoverMisAlign.jpg".
It appears to me (without other info) that this cover belongs on a
10" machine. The other thing that makes me wonder about the guard is
that there are 4 unused holes, even though there is a lube chart
plate attached. See attached photo "CoverPlate.jpg". There were some
shims (2- 1/16"x3/8"x3/4") that fell out when I disassemble the
bracket, but I've tried them back in and can't find a configuration
that properly aligns the guard. Rick (2606) |
| Looks just
like mine does and has for over 30 years. JWE (2609) |
| The hinge pin
is on an eccentric. There should be a set-screw to allow the pin to
rotate. This adjustment is for front-back alignment. Once you get
this right, then slide the hinge-arm along the rear way (set-screws,
again) and align the in-out. Finally, shim washers are used for the
up-down adjustment. The eccentric hinge-pin on my 1941 lathe needed
some persuasion to rotate. Paul R. (2611) |
| Rick, Looks like
the cover is not from this lathe originally. It may have had the
"Pick Gear" chart on it at one time and lather removed and the
lubrication chart put there in its place. The instructions for
adjusting the cover is correct for those lathes the have an
eccentric. The earlier lathes had the cover jigged in place and
babbit poured around the pivot pin. These can be identified by the
top of the pivot in the cover being filed flush with cover and
painted over. If yours is one of these, you can either melt out the
babbit, re-jig the cover and pour OR (and I recommend) make an
eccentric to fit your cover. I had to do this on one lathe I had
long ago and I worked out great. Webb (2632) |
| Of handles and
covers |
| I am
thinking about casting some gear covers (the big one on the end and
the two that go on top of the headstock) and countershaft tightening
handles out of Zamak. It is a pretty tough zinc alloy. Might even do
some tailstock wrenches. Anyone have any suggestions on price and if
it is even worth my time to do it? Gerald (3382) |
| I think that the
gearcovers could be cast in aluminum with good success. cheap too,
unless of course you had to consume all the liquid beverages to
recover all the cans you'd need. I think that you could put steel
inserts on the wearing points to save the aluminum. dp (3386) |
| My dad worked in
the aluminum casting department at Maytag, and he told me that
Maytag, in an effort to cut costs, acquired several tons of smashed
beer cans to recycle, he said the first problem was that they tend
to float in the furnace, and secondly, the smell was atrocious,
rancid, burning, boiling, beer! Yuck! Clear Lexan would make neat
gear covers also. Matt (3387) |
| It
would be very cool to mold the covers out of a clear plastic but I
don't think our casting machinery is up to that quite yet. Gerald (3394) |
| We used Zamak to
make chassis for two-way FM radios when I worked at Motorola 15
years ago. The ME's said that the material was especially suited for
making thin wall castings. The parts were pretty complicated and I
think some of the interior dividing walls were about 50 mils thick
or less. Repeated screwing and unscrewing of fasteners made
helicoils very popular in the development lab, though. Glen
(3407) |
| I haven't received
enough interested to even bother with this project. I might make a
couple for myself but the mold is gonna cost a least $100 so I don't
think I will be doing it in the near future. I am also thinking
about contacting a local powder coating facility about doing the
gear covers. Question? How does the little flippy cover on the one
gear cover hang on? I have a gear cover that looks like it should
have the little door that flips up and out of the way when pulling
the pin for backgear engagement pin but I have no door (cover?). I
don't even see where or how it should mount. Gerald
(3410) |
| SB 9" Gear Door
Fit |
| I have 2 SB 9's.
Neither gear door fits properly. Obviously the door can be adjusted
"up" but these do not fit "front to back" or "to and away from the
rear mounted motor". This is based on the spindle hole not lining up
with the door. The only logical explanation is that I have
mismatched doors but I am fairly certain that one of the lathes has
never been apart and both fit improperly in the same basic attitude.
They would be adjustable if the pin in the door was on an eccentric
but this does not appear to be the case. Any ideas? Doc
(9137) |
| I notice the same
problem on a number of the South Bend lathes, including the bolt-on
gear cover on my 1943 Heavy 10, which is held on by two long 1/4-20
bolts on either side of the spindle hole and a short 1/4-20 screw
into the quick change gearbox. I'm fairly sure it's the original
cover. I made eccentric extension studs for mine, with the female
1/4" thread offset from the center by the dimension needed to
provide the correct alignment. That doesn't correct
oversize/undersize castings, obviously, but at least the hole is
lined up with the spindle now. I don't think the castings are all
that precise, based on what I've seen - but then, the misfits are
only cosmetic in nature and don't affect the function in any way.
Why don't you simply make eccentric pins for them? Nice little
project! BTW, Doc, I never received a reply on the South Bend rocker
tool post I sent you as a gift a couple of years ago. I sure hope it
arrived safely. Mike (9139) |
| Doc, It sounds
like you have the earlier style end gear guard. On older SBL's, the
pivot pin is grossly undersized to the hole in the guard and is held
in by babbit. These were aligned at the factory and babbit was
poured around the pivot pin to preserve the alignment. Later lathes
use an eccentric system. You can knocked out or melt out the babbit
and machine a new eccentric type pivot pin for your guards. Factory
made eccentric pivot pins were longer. They fit through the pivot
bracket and are threaded on the lower end and must be long enough to
accommodate two thin style jam nuts. I have made my own eccentric
when retro-fitting an older style guards to another lathe. As to
adjusting, I have included a scan that should help. If your end gear
guard is too high, you will have to machine (of file) some of the
metal off of the guard around the bottom of the pivot pin hole. You
may have to do this anyway to smooth up the surface for you spacers
(if needed).
Webb (9140) |
| I asked the same
question of Pete Swelzen of PKE, my local machine-tool-and-parts
dealer [good guy to do business with FWIW]...because my parts book
shows it on an eccentric etc and there ain't no eccentric on my
lathe and the pin is slightly loose According to Pete, the pin it
pivots on, is leaded [babbitted] into the door casting and all you
gotta do is heat it up and. One of these days I'll take it
completely apart and see about making an eccentric bushing for
it but since nothing rubs I pretty much ignore it. (9141) |
| Back gear cover
for a 10 |
| I bought some
equipment at an auction the other day and laying in the chip tray of
the milling machine is a back gear cover for a SB10. This is the
part that covers the gear on the headstock spindle only. It does not
cover the rest of the gears. Anyone interested? Mike (13589) |
| I took a picture of
this cover and posted it in the photo section. It has a casting
number on the inside that reads, "670R1". I think that it is for a
heavy 10, but I'm not certain. Can anyone verify the lathe model for
which this cover was made? Mike (13621) |
| Mike: According to
info I have this cover PT # 670R1 is called an "Upper Guard" and it
bolts onto "Lower Guard" PT # AS671R1 which then bolts onto back of
lathe and would cover banjo and gears on end of machine as well as
protect end of spindle at back of machine. It is indeed for a 10"
SB. Ron (13624) |
| Mike: BTW my info
makes no distinction on this part for Light or Heavy 10". Parts list
just has 10". (13626) |
| Thank you Ron. Will it fit a 10L? Do you have anything that you could
share that shows how this part attaches? Mike (13630) |
| Mike: Not being too
familiar with 10" lathes ( I own a 13" myself ) but having copied
some info we had at work, picture from parts list I have just shows
one part # for 10" machines. Typically parts book will specify for
10L or 10K only if there is a difference. I could scan and send to
you if you want. Not too familiar with scans to group listings and I
know you can not attach to group E-Mails. I try to keep scans to a
minimum as I am only on regular Dial-Up Service and it takes too
long. Ron (13632) |
| Mike It will
clearly fit a 10L. My "heavy 10" parts list shows this part number
as correct for the 10", 1" collet (i.e. 10L) lathe. Although not
shown explicitly in my parts list, based on the part number (with an
R) I would expect it to fit the 10R (i.e. heavy 10 with the little
spindle bore) as well. I would be surprised if it fits the 10K.
First, there are not many headstock parts in common (the 10K is an
offshoot of the 9"), but also that part does not show up in my parts
list for the 10K. In fact there appears to be no such upper guard on
a 10K that I can see in my list. Frank
(13634) |
| 9 " gear cover
mounting pin |
| I have a change
gear cover or guard that has a very loose mounting pin. It appears
to be fastened in the casting With a soft material like aluminum.
The looseness is such that I have to block it up about ¬ to « in. to
clear the spindle. My first impulse is to remove the soft material
and replace with a bushing , however , it occurs to me that the
factory may have used this method to insure clearance at the
spindle. AL (14303) |
| Mine is the same
way--according to Pete Welzen at PKE, these pins are 'babbited
in'--seated in babbit which is poured in there. Someday I'll heat it
up with a torch and lay some low-melting-point solder or plumber's
lead in there. (14304) |
| Brian is right
about it being seated in babbit. You block the cover up in place and
then pour in babbit much as you would with a babitted bearing. That
insures everything is lined up. It would be hard to get a bushing to
line up properly. For those of us who don't know how or don't want
to learn how to babbit, bondo will probably work. I haven't tried
this yet though. First I have to weld the bracket that I broke when
I over tightened the clamp. John (14316) |
| Both of my lathes
gear covers have babbitted pins for mounting and they both have
sagged over the years. I helped one of them with a little hammering
around the pin to keep it from moving. The other one was less
cooperative. Someday, I'll drill out the babbit and make an
eccentric pin for adjustment as I've seen in one of the parts
manuals. Until then, the cover doesn't get closed all the way so it
doesn't ride on the spindle. Glen (14317) |
| I had the same
problem with gear cover sag (helped along by bending the clamp-on
bracket when trying to pick the lathe up). My "temporary" fix was
to shim under the clamp until the cover cleared the spindle. Luckily
the fix is hidden behind the lathe, so I don't have to look at it
every day! Tom (14318) |
| 9" gear cover
hinge pin |
| The change gear
cover on my SB9 has what looks like a makeshift repair to the hinge
pin. It appears to be a 1/2 inch steel pin with some kind of soft
metal used to build up the diameter to 3/4 inch for the cover's
pivot hole to fit on. The repair was not well done as the built-up
end is clearly not concentric or even parallel to the steel pin at
it's core. I suspect that the best way to repair this will be to
make a new, all steel pin. My problem is I can't tell how this pin
was originally designed. Did it pivot on the 1/2" end in the support
bracket or on the 3/4" end in the cover? There's a set
screw in the support
bracket that seems to be at the level of a reduced diameter groove
on the pin. Was this set screw intended to be tight, preventing
rotation of the 1/2" end? Or was it just supposed to be loose in the
groove, allowing rotation but preventing the cover from coming off?
was there any provision for retaining the cover on the 3/4" end of
the pin? Or could it just be lifted off vertically? Paul A. (14373) |
| I have a
loose pin also and would like to fix it once and for all. The
factory seems to have used babbit to set the pin so that the cover
clears the spindle. Even a small error in the location in any
direction will cause interference between cover and spindle. I
haven't had guts enough to remove the babbit and pin to find out
what the hole in the cover is. Have you done so , and if so, is the
hole in the cover machined , what size, is it straight through or
stepped? I think a pin with the lower ,smaller dia. eccentric to the
larger dia. will work to obtain left and right adj. Washers between
the cover and mounting bracket would adj. for up and down. I have
lived with a block of wood holding the cover up for long enough. Alvin (14380) |
| My 1942 vintage
machine had no problems with the hinge pin, but the hole still
didn't line up with the spindle. I found that the adjustment is
actually done on the bracket where it rests on the bed. By filing
the bracket very carefully you can line things up. I believe that
setscrew is in a groove on mine. You can loosen it with your fingers
to remove the gear guard. Rob (14381) |
| Alvin, I may be off
base cause I haven't followed this thread but, if we're talking
about the same thing, mine is different. To explain. Top casting
(lathe side) has an about a 1" hole bored from the bottom almost
thru the top. Top of same casting has a 5/8 + - drill thru.
"alignment" pin is about 1" dia with a 3/8" hole drilled thru
slightly (1/8) off center. A 3/8 + - bolt/pin with a 1/8 thick 1"
dia. head goes thru the top casting, thru the "alignment pin, thru
the cover hole, and is held in place with TWO wide, flat nuts.
Adjust as required and tension with the first nut then lock with the
second nut. The other plane is adjust by sliding the mount on the
rear inverted "v." BTW my 9" is from the late 60's. This is all from
memory (I'm old) and subject to me not knowing what the hell I'm
talking about, if it makes any sense or helps at all, I'll check and
report. Any help? Larry (14388) |
| Rob, So, is your
pin a single piece or what? Paul A. (14391) |
| Alvin, So the pin
is "fixed" in the cover's hole with the babbit and it pivots in the
bracket's hole. I was thinking that the babbit was a makeshift
repair, not factory. so the set screw is not to be tight, just in
the groove to prevent the cover from being lifter off. Mine was
already loose because the babbit was cracking. I suspect someone may
have tightened the set screw as I can see indentations in the pin
and broke the babbit by forcing it open. Not the best design. I
don't know if it will work on yours but I just punched the pin out
with a few blows on the bottom end of the pin with a wood block to
protect it. The babbit was so loose it came out easily. The hole in
the cover is just 3/4" diameter, straight through. I have started to
make a new pin with one end at 1/2" and the other 3/4" to fit the
two holes. I haven't yet decided which end to fix and which one to
use as the pivot. Paul A.(14399) |
| Paul , Your post
was just the information I needed. The ? dia. Should be fixed,
possibly with a set screw . The cover pivots on the pin is held
close by tightening the thumb screw on the on the mounting bracket.
At least that is how it is on my lathe. Since you indicated you are
in the process of making a new pin for your lathe , I will hold off
until I hear how it turned out.
Alvin (14401) |
| Paul,
and all others who have posted messages re: loose pin on 9 gear cover,
The saga is now over. After I read Paul s message, I just had to fix
the beast. Chiseled out some of the babbit, knocked out the pin and
rest of the babbit. Sure enough the pin was offset about .050 (using a
depth mic.). Removed babbit. The part of the pin in the babbit had a
sharp diamond knurl. Ready to make my offset pin. Got a short piece of
? brass bar stock. To my surprise it was loose in the casting. The xxx
thing is a raw cast hole, and tapered too. Sure shot down my idea of a
machined offset pin. Found some 95 % tin solder , mounted the cover in
place , got my trusty torch, and melted away. Fill it up with a
beautiful mound. So I turned off the torch. Looked back at my creation,
the dammed hole was half empty, solder had run out !!! OK I let the
bottom solidify and refilled. By this time the casting was kinda hot.
After it cooled, every thing lined up just right. The pin was a nat's
eyelash loose, so I used a drift pin to pack the solder. All is now
well in the world, MY Gear cover is very snug, has good clearance
around the spindle and I am happy. Alvin (14403) |
| 10k motor belt
guard |
| I have a 1956 light
ten south bend lathe. Did this machine come with a v-belt guard from
the motor to the horizontal shaft? If so, are they still available?
Chuck (19141) |
| Yes there was
a guard. Seen occasionally on eBay. Take a look at item 1 , doc 905G
on this site:
http://www.zetagraphics.com/shop/sbparts/905G.pdf Peter
(19146) |
| Are there any such
pdf's for a 10L Heavy ten?
http://www.zetagraphics.com/shop/sbparts/905G.pdf Peter (19147) |
| End Gear Cover
|
| The mounting
pin on my 9"SB end gear guard is loose and on close inspection seems
to be soldered into the aluminum casting, not the eccentric shown in
the Army Technical Manual. Is this another factory way of installing
the pin or a repair made sometime in the long history of my lathe?
I've also noted that the "bearing" for the tailstock end of the
apron drive shaft appears to have a poured-in-place lead (babbit?)
bearing- stock or another possible repair? I could find no reference
in the manual about the drive shaft or this bearing at all.
Mark (24258) |
| My 1942 model A
also has the pin soldered. Nick (24303) |
| Mine is the same
but it looks more like lead was poured in around the pin rather than
it being soldered. I always thought that was a quick way to adjust
the guard. Set the pin in the bracket, adjust the guard so it fits
properly and then pour lead around the pin. John (24305) |
